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Venomous Snake Warning

Printed From: Reptiles and Amphibians of the UK
Category: Herpetofauna Native to the UK
Forum Name: Adder
Forum Description: Forum for all issues concerning Vipera berus
URL: http://www.herpetofauna.co.uk/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=4235
Printed Date: 20 Apr 2024 at 6:44am
Software Version: Web Wiz Forums 11.06 - http://www.webwizforums.com


Topic: Venomous Snake Warning
Posted By: Chris Monk
Subject: Venomous Snake Warning
Date Posted: 23 May 2012 at 7:45pm
That's the first media headline to pick up on an unwanted press release by the Health Protection Agency titled that was released this afternoon.

Country walking? Think snakes...

Poisons experts are advising people planning country and woodland walks this summer how to reduce their risk of a snake bite.

The media article states
Walkers have been warned not to touch snakes after a spate of venomous adder attacks over the past three years.

The HPA were warned that this would be the likely reaction to the press release and still they went ahead. Expect more sensational bad publicity and idiots everywhere killing any grass snake, slow-worm or adder that they come across.
http://www.hpa.org.uk/webw/HPAweb&HPAwebStandard/HPAweb_C/1317134275836 - http://www.hpa.org.uk/webw/HPAweb&HPAwebStandard/HPAweb_C/1317134275836
Nowhere does the press release mention that snakes are legally protected!

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Chris

Derbyshire Amphibian & Reptile Group

www.derbyshirearg.co.uk




Replies:
Posted By: will
Date Posted: 23 May 2012 at 8:00pm
what with Allerthorpe and the inevitable conclusion that it's OK to kill snakes if you are / work for a conservation organisation and this press release it's certainly a bad time to be a snake...


Posted By: AGILIS
Date Posted: 24 May 2012 at 5:34am
Panic shriek Panic warnings poison snakes infesting and attacking children picnickers and dog walkers thats about he best way to get the jo public to be hostile toward them.
Do you ever see "WARNINGS" that Squirrels and deer badgers and even horses will inflict nasty bites on people "NO NEVER".   I would rather be bitten by an adder then a horse. (sounds a bit like a Duke of Wellington quotation). Funny they never erect warning signs informing people to beware of wasp and bees more deaths have occurred from insect bites then from snake bites in this country, but not for long as they are also in decline due to ruined habitat.     keith

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   LOCAL ICYNICAL CELTIC ECO WARRIOR AND FAILED DRUID


Posted By: Ginger!
Date Posted: 24 May 2012 at 7:53pm
It's a bit scaremongering and could do with some rewording. 'Attacks' suggests a creature predating humans. Hmmm. Anyway Keith, isn't it time for some more pics from you??  I'm off to Thetford tomorrow for some cycling but I'll stop for a little light herping. Normally good for a couple of sightings but I'm no photographer. Hopefully I won't get 'attacked' by some huge serpent...


Posted By: Chris d
Date Posted: 24 May 2012 at 8:48pm
jeremy vine picked up on the the subject of adder bites today on Radio 2. It ws pretty interested as they also discussed adder sites in Wales and garden sightings.  


Posted By: AGILIS
Date Posted: 24 May 2012 at 9:06pm
Hi Ginger got few lv and slowies the other day ,but the weather has now gone the other way to bloody hot or to cold lol perhaps I will have to do nocturnal shots hope I dont get attacked by bats.

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   LOCAL ICYNICAL CELTIC ECO WARRIOR AND FAILED DRUID


Posted By: GemmaJF
Date Posted: 24 May 2012 at 11:42pm
Can't the HPA do something useful like ban staircases? Apparently one of the largest causes of death and personal injury in the UK. It is now an established fact that nearly as many deaths occur in the home as in road accidents. Many of these deaths are due to falls, half of which involve stairs.

There you have it, a clear thing for the HPA to do.

That can keep them busy instead of wasting money scaremongering regarding wild snakes in the UK which have accounted for, lets think, eeer.....  exactly zero deaths in the past 100 years...



Posted By: AGILIS
Date Posted: 25 May 2012 at 5:49am
Gemma zero deaths NE with the help of health & safety wish to eliminated any chance this sort numbers of deaths occurring in the future

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   LOCAL ICYNICAL CELTIC ECO WARRIOR AND FAILED DRUID


Posted By: will
Date Posted: 25 May 2012 at 6:36am
'Can't the HPA do something useful like ban staircases? Apparently one of the largest causes of death and personal injury in the UK.' (Gemma)
 
- also don't forget that the most dangerous place is a bed - you're more likely to die there than anywhere else.  Each bed should therefore come with a mandatory health warning and training course on how to use one properly ...


Posted By: GemmaJF
Date Posted: 25 May 2012 at 10:27am
I'll never sleep again Will, not only am I taking a huge risk going to bed, I have to climb a stairs to get there! I think I'll take to sleeping on heathlands where there are no staircases or beds....

 ....the only risk then will be being killed by a bulldozer Dead


Posted By: AGILIS
Date Posted: 25 May 2012 at 11:56am
Gemma you mean where there are no snakes not beds keith

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   LOCAL ICYNICAL CELTIC ECO WARRIOR AND FAILED DRUID


Posted By: GemmaJF
Date Posted: 26 May 2012 at 12:51am
Snakes on heathland?? Who ever heard of such a thing Keith? If I saw any I would report them immediately to Natural England so they could be eradicated as part of their ongoing holistic approach to nature conservation.

Good job we all have a sense of humour on here it isn't it Wink


Posted By: sussexecology
Date Posted: 26 May 2012 at 8:48pm
Originally posted by GemmaJF GemmaJF wrote:

Can't the HPA do something useful like ban staircases? Apparently one of the largest causes of death and personal injury in the UK. It is now an established fact that nearly as many deaths occur in the home as in road accidents. Many of these deaths are due to falls, half of which involve stairs.

There you have it, a clear thing for the HPA to do.

That can keep them busy instead of wasting money scaremongering regarding wild snakes in the UK which have accounted for, lets think, eeer.....  exactly zero deaths in the past 100 years...



Injury from falls is right i would say

I remember when I fell off a gate back in 2006 and I was off work for at least 6 weeks, and when I went back to work I was still limited in what I could do. I apparently snapped a ligament in my knee and was very lucky it wasn't more serious than that (hospital staff said i was very lucky).

Can't imagine anything worse than that to be honest but it happened right in the middle of the survey season a

Top tip for prevention:
Don't climb over a gate if you can open it, especially if you are tired!!!!

Accident could have been prevented def but i was too lazy to open the gate....

Was just annoyed by people ringing  me constantly on the mobile, despite me saying i was off sick at the time.

cheers

regards
SE Reptile Ecologist




Posted By: sussexecology
Date Posted: 26 May 2012 at 10:30pm
Originally posted by GemmaJF GemmaJF wrote:

.

Good job we all have a sense of humour on here it isn't it Wink




Most definately  Smile

Life is too short so we need a sense of humour but apparently we do have on here - which is good to know.

Which reminds me what happened to that thread with the pictures and captions ....it seems to have disappared and not been touched for ages..............think we need to start that up again for sure.

Snakes on heathland ............ yeap better inform the people in charge who willl no doubt destroy the population  in the foreseeable future.
You know I'm kidding right Smile  so please don't take the above comment as it sounds,

regards
SE Reptile Ecologist




Posted By: AGILIS
Date Posted: 27 May 2012 at 10:48am
Well just back from a scorching boot sale this morning ,On the way going there at 6am radio Suffolk news reported that the Suffolk wild life trust is playing down their snake bite warning that they put out a few days a go, because of this hot weather according to them brings loads of snakes out I think its the opposite ,what a load of panic stricken bloody cretins to think these people hold some form of authority within the wild life trust, I am sure their raising the alarm has done a world of good within the public vigilantes beating the heaths with their anti snake sticks to rid us of dangerous beasts that lurk threatening their dogs and kids on a hot day keith

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   LOCAL ICYNICAL CELTIC ECO WARRIOR AND FAILED DRUID


Posted By: GemmaJF
Date Posted: 27 May 2012 at 12:09pm
I think we would all agree the hot weather makes snake encounters far less likely. 

What happens is that more people go out in the countryside on nice days. As it appears that many these days have absolutely no sense and will pick up snakes, sit on them and walk around on heaths and in long grass in nothing more than sandals or trainers, a handful of them get bitten each year. 

I think in many cases adder are blamed for any bites, where certainly some can be attributed to insect stings, spider bites and simply thorns. Plenty of reported cases of 'adder bites'  crop up where none have ever been recorded.

It's no surprise to me a Wildlife Trust would consider itself an authority on the subject. EWT even take on consultancy work. You can guess the results, considering they came up with the gem that there were no suitable sites iin Essex for the translocation of the Gateway animals. Dead

I guess Suffolk Wildlilfe Trust were just afraid someone might get bitten at one of their sites over the weekend and sue them. 

I can quite honestly say I now feel there is absolutely no place for a native reptiles in the current picture of wildlife conservation. How terribly sad that is.


Posted By: tim-f
Date Posted: 27 May 2012 at 7:03pm
26 degC on Mendip and definitely not the best conditions to see herps.  I caught a glimpse out of the corner of my eye of (I think) a Common Lizard and also what was probably a female Adder disappearing very quickly.  Otherwise diddly.

I did though see a superb pair of Redstarts - my first for about 20 years.

This snake bite scaremongering is similar to the bad press that sharks get.  Periodically a holiday maker will see a Basking Shark off a Cornish beach and assume it's a Great White.  Of course the newspapers love that, as "Benign Plankton Eater Seen Off Coast (Which is Actually Quite a Common Occurence)" isn't much of a headline.

I went to a lecture by the Shark Trust, about shark attacks in the UK.  Not surprisingly there've been very few.  As I recall the only fatality was many years ago when (probably) a Basking Shark knocked a small boat and someone drowned as a result.

Other UK shark attacks include a pub landlady who received head wounds, when a stuffed shark fell off the wall and onto her.  Then there was a chef who was driving to a resaurant with a 2m Porbeagle on ice in the back of his van.  When he braked sharply it shot forward and its teeth gashed his arm.

People kill 70 to 100 million sharks each year, primarily for their fins.  The fins are cut off and the sharks thrown back into the water to die.

Is there nobody or no body that could be lobbied to help protect British herps?  What about the HCT and/or Amphibian and Reptile Conservation people?  Apologies if I've missed reference to these organisations.



Posted By: Chris d
Date Posted: 27 May 2012 at 7:13pm
 
Can I get this right..... Is it while sleeping in bed when most people die ? Because I really don't want to give up you know what. Wink


Posted By: sussexecology
Date Posted: 27 May 2012 at 8:11pm

Chris:  Think you should be ok, unless you are sleeping in a tent. Smile

Gemma; That is very sad, and a reason why I don't want to move into the conservation sector, because they haven't got a clue on the needs for reptiles.

Regards
SE Reptiles Ecologist




Posted By: sussexecology
Date Posted: 27 May 2012 at 8:19pm
Originally posted by tim-f tim-f wrote:

26 degC on Mendip and definitely not the best conditions to see herps.  I caught a glimpse out of the corner of my eye of (I think) a Common Lizard and also what was probably a female Adder disappearing very quickly.  Otherwise diddly.





Reptiles pretty hyperactive at the moment Smile

Having said that, I was on a site earlier in the week and the temperature when I started the survey was the upper limit, and I was wondering whether it would be worth terminating the survey. However, I was still finding slow worms under the refugia - but must admit now it is getting too hot even for me to be out surveying.  Refugia was Onduline so heats up far faster i reckon than roofing felt. Lizards basking on top of my onduline too so altogether a good session.

If you want to find reptiles in these conditions, go much earlier in the day before it's heated up..............

Waiting for a break in the weather, like rain though and forecasts look like that on Monday afternoon...... Oh dear though, it is that another weather warning i see.

Do people (reptile ecologists) die in thunder-storms then ???
Esp if you have corrugated iron on your site and you pick it up at just the wrong moment. Ouch! 

Regards
SE Reptile Ecologist


Posted By: Chris Monk
Date Posted: 28 May 2012 at 11:25pm
Unfortunately some local papers are even taking this article up and a local one here has even claimed the warning is due to "a rise in reports of sightings of adders — especially in South Derbyshire."
http://www.burtonmail.co.uk/News/Increase-in-adder-sightings-leads-to-summer-warning-25052012.htm - http://www.burtonmail.co.uk/News/Increase-in-adder-sightings-leads-to-summer-warning-25052012.htm
This is very interesting news to us because:
a) There are no adders in South Derbyshire and certainly no rise in the reports of adders. There is only one location definitely known now for adders in the National Forest and it's nowhere near South Derbyshire
b) For whatever reason the HPA issued the warning, best known to themselves, it wasn't based on increased sightings or even increased numbers of queries about adder bites.

I did lend Amy from OPAL an adder slough for showing at the Live 'n' Deadly roadshow at the National Forest Conkers Centre last year. Perhaps it was possessed by the ghost of an angry adder and bit the children at the event or perhaps it became re-animated and is now roaming South Derbyshire terrifying the local population!


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Chris

Derbyshire Amphibian & Reptile Group

www.derbyshirearg.co.uk



Posted By: sussexecology
Date Posted: 29 May 2012 at 12:18am
Originally posted by Chris d Chris d wrote:

 
Can I get this right..... Is it while sleeping in bed when most people die ? Because I really don't want to give up you know what. Wink


Other things you can die from:

- heat exhaustion/sun burn

- lack of sleep - if like me you are up at this hour because it is too damn hot -

......or in the case where you are sleeping in a tent on a heathland where adders are known to be present and therefore likelihood of a bite in the middle of the night.
But thankfully  i am not sleeping in a tent on a heathland tonight

- falls out of bed

- bitten by an snake which is not native in this country:
sorry had to add that one in because that is the mood i am in at the moment, and is extreme must admit

you will have to excuse my sense of humour tonight Smile.
I blame the weather - it is too damn hot tonight

Happy dreams people....
I'm going back to bed as seriously need some sleep.....

Regards
SE Reptile Ecologist




Posted By: GemmaJF
Date Posted: 29 May 2012 at 12:25am
Just the sort of knee jerk nonsense one would expect after the HPA 'warning' Chris.

It really does seem at the moment that adder are not having much luck. I almost feel the next news I'll hear is there is some government plan to totally eradicate adder from the UK.




Posted By: sussexecology
Date Posted: 29 May 2012 at 12:48am
Originally posted by GemmaJF GemmaJF wrote:

Just the sort of knee jerk nonsense one would expect after the HPA 'warning' Chris.

It really does seem at the moment that adder are not having much luck. I almost feel the next news I'll hear is there is some government plan to totally eradicate adder from the UK.




Any negative story about adders will bring out the newspaper articles. And the journalists seem to revel in these sorts of things. I don't think it is helping the adders in the long run because there is a fear of adders (and snakes in general) in the view of the general public.

So many people who ask me what i do for a living and i say "reptile ecologist " immediately refer to adders and how dangerous they are, and how they hate them etc etc.

To be fair, I only know one person who has been bitten - and twice! And he was ok, and besides adders aren't really going to bite you are they.......

Anyone remember the press coverage about the fox attacking people in their beds at night?
Never heard anything so stuipid and daft.

 And the HPA warning - that is just bonkers.

Still up as it is too hot.....

Regards
SE Reptile Ecologist
 


Posted By: GemmaJF
Date Posted: 29 May 2012 at 11:11am
Keith's started a thread on the topic SE. I've been tagged twice also and had absolutely no ill effects. 

Adder bites normally though are certainly unpleasant and to be avoided. We don't need scaremongering though, a simple message to wear sensible footwear when out and about in the countryside and keeping dogs on leads would have done. Also of course a timely reminder that adder are a protected species. 

I am all for the public being warned about the risk of adder bite, god only knows that we don't need is a death in the UK due to one. However the HPA should have been aware of the likely public response to using language such as 'attacks'. I've been around adder a long long time, they never attack you, all bites are purely defensive from their point of view. The only things that need to fear being attacked by adders are lizards, voles and shrews!


Posted By: Iowarth
Date Posted: 29 May 2012 at 10:52pm
It sometimes appears, at least so far as the media are concerned that we are indeed reverting to Victorian values - as in the oft-quoted saying from that era "This animal is dangerous - it defends itself when attacked"!

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Chris Davis, Site Administrator

Co-ordinator, Sand Lizard Captive Breeding Programme (RETIRED)



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