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Berus, or Ursinii? |
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Alan Hyde
Senior Member Joined: 17 Apr 2003 Location: United Kingdom Status: Offline Points: 1437 |
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Hi Martin, thanks. Most interesting, i might email the guy and ask him.
Alan |
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Wolfgang Wuster
Senior Member Joined: 23 Apr 2003 Location: United Kingdom Status: Offline Points: 374 |
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If you go to the forum at kingsnake.com (URL: http://forums.kingsnake.com/forum.php?catid=87 ), someone called Janne has given the locality of the animal - it was from Finland. He/she (sorry, not sure) also posted a couple of other photos of Estonian adders - including a couple with a very weird striped pattern, as seen in some V. seoanei.
Cheers, Wolfgang |
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Alan Hyde
Senior Member Joined: 17 Apr 2003 Location: United Kingdom Status: Offline Points: 1437 |
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Hi Wolfgang , I've just been looking at those also, they're really strange eh . I'd still like to know if these snakes are CB or WC's though , and if wild caught ,where did they find the striped ones? Here's the link for anyone that'd like a look- http://forums.kingsnake.com/forum.php?catid=87 As Wolfgang said the messages and pics are posted by someone called Janne.
Cheers , Alan |
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Alan Hyde
Senior Member Joined: 17 Apr 2003 Location: United Kingdom Status: Offline Points: 1437 |
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Also , I forgot, So are these Estonian adders still berus? Al |
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Wolfgang Wuster
Senior Member Joined: 23 Apr 2003 Location: United Kingdom Status: Offline Points: 374 |
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Alan,
Estonian adders are Vipera berus berus, just like those from the rest of northern Europe and Asia. There is a paper by a Swiss/Swedish group coming out soon that shpws that they are in fact remarkably homogeneous genetically across most of their vast range. Cheers, Wolfgang |
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Alan Hyde
Senior Member Joined: 17 Apr 2003 Location: United Kingdom Status: Offline Points: 1437 |
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Hi Wolfgang , Thanks for that info. That's really quite amazing , you'd have thought that there would be some differences . Cheers, Alan |
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Alan Hyde
Senior Member Joined: 17 Apr 2003 Location: United Kingdom Status: Offline Points: 1437 |
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"
"Also, venom of bosniensis is said to be more toxic." So, Aside from bosniensis, is the venom of berus throughout its complete range identical in its properties? Alan |
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Wolfgang Wuster
Senior Member Joined: 23 Apr 2003 Location: United Kingdom Status: Offline Points: 374 |
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No idea about variation in venom composition.
As far as my statement of genetic homogeneity was concerned, it did not include bosniensis or the Alpine region, where there is considerable diversity! Some authors are already treating bosniensis as a separate species, and what Tony said about the mating system would certainly support that notion! Cheers, Wolfgang |
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